16:06:39 <API> #startmeeting
16:06:39 <tota11y> Meeting started Thu Nov 29 16:06:39 2012 CET.  The chair is API. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
16:06:39 <tota11y> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic.
16:07:24 <API> #topic JAW
16:07:46 <API> #info API sent that mail to gnome-accessibility, ccing peter korn, as agreed on last meeting
16:07:53 <API> #info asking about the status of JAW
16:07:55 <API> questions?
16:08:21 <mgorse> Huh. I'm not seeing the build error on my machine.
16:08:48 <mgorse> but will be interesting to see if anyone replies, in any case
16:09:02 <API> well, probably that would depend on the environment
16:09:05 <mgorse> though it could be as Joanie was worrying about, that Peter will say nice things but nothing will happen
16:09:45 <clown> API, I'm looking at your email to the gnome a11y list.  I don't see the cc to peter korn.  Was it a bcc?
16:09:49 <API> but at least we would need where we are
16:10:13 <API> clown, joanie also pointed that
16:10:20 <API> on my sent folder
16:10:23 <API> peter is CCed
16:10:31 <API> so not sure why doesn't appear there
16:10:42 <API> probably because peter is also subscribed or something
16:10:45 <clown> okay.  dang email client apps!
16:11:39 <API> so if nobody else asks, I will move to next point
16:11:56 <API> #topic Outreach Program for Women
16:12:30 <API> #info some students appeared at the #a11y
16:12:54 <API> #info and we didn't have too much to offer, except, "take a look around, and then told us in what are you interested"
16:13:14 <API> #info the only specific task was review the jaw thing
16:13:49 <API> #info so if we are interested, it would be good to have a list of tasks to propose
16:14:02 <API> clown, I think that we talked last year about that
16:14:18 <API> and you had a task in the buffer, not sure if that it is still available
16:14:25 <clown> API, yes I had a proposal a while back — has it been a year already?
16:14:39 <clown> API, I have zero time for that now, though.
16:15:06 <API> ok
16:15:26 <API> anyway, it would be good  if everybody thinks about a task to propose
16:15:33 <clown> the task is stil there; I can look up the description, and if someone else wants to mentor it, they can go for ti.
16:15:44 <API> something that a intern/student could work on
16:16:03 <API> clown, so please, for minutes sake, could you info that and put the link?
16:16:10 * clown looks for link
16:18:11 <clown> found it.
16:18:56 <clown> #info Joseph described a OPW project approximately a year ago.
16:19:04 <clown> #info the description is at this link:  https://live.gnome.org/Accessibility/AriaAutomatedTesting
16:19:17 <clown> #info at this time, Joseph does not have the time to mentor anyone.
16:19:21 <clown> (done)
16:19:37 <API> ok, thanks
16:20:01 <API> anyway, for everybody listening ...
16:20:10 <API> although today we are not so many ...
16:20:26 <API> #action API will send a mail to the list about the OPW thing
16:21:12 <API> so lets move to next topic,
16:21:20 <API> #topic Python 3
16:21:32 <API> well, in theory the star here is jhernandez ... that it is n ot here
16:21:34 <API> anyway
16:21:42 <clown> I have something...
16:21:48 <API> #info jjardon had some GNOME 3.7.2
16:21:52 <API> ups
16:21:56 <API> clown, a moment please
16:22:07 <clown> sure. go ahead.
16:22:09 <API> #info jjardon had some problems releasing GNOME 3.7.2
16:22:37 <API> #info were related to the fact that the move is still not complete
16:22:59 <API> #info our hard target would be have accerciser fully moved to python3 to next release
16:23:06 <API> #info we already have the patches
16:23:24 <API> #info 3.7.3, needed before December 12th at 23:59 UTC
16:23:27 <API> (done)
16:24:44 <API> clown, you can add your "something" now if you want
16:24:49 <clown> okay...
16:25:04 <clown> #info Joseph has been checking the interim focus tracker with python3
16:25:21 <clown> #info It definitely needs modifications.
16:25:49 <clown> #info the problems are confined to the dbus interface, or the way one calls into dbus using python3
16:26:06 <clown> #info there are *no* issues with pyatsip2.
16:26:11 <clown> questions?
16:26:48 <mgorse> If you're using the gio/gdbus bindings now, then, yeah, that API is going to be different
16:27:26 <clown> mgorse: I don't think I have a choice — if one runs under python3, don't you have to use gio/gdbus?
16:27:51 <mgorse> I imagine so
16:28:11 <API> ok
16:28:18 <API> so anything else on this python3 point?
16:28:21 <API> ah yes
16:28:36 * clown sees a light bulb over API's head.
16:28:39 <API> #action joanie or API, will ping jhernandez, as he was not at the meeting
16:28:53 <API> probably I should also ping caribou people
16:29:04 <API> anyway, if nobody has more questions, we can move
16:29:51 <API> ok, nobody talking
16:29:53 <API> moving
16:29:55 <API> #topic GNOME 3.8 updates
16:30:04 <API> #info GNOME 3.7.2 was released this week
16:30:24 <API> #info as mentioned, python3 port still wip, so somewhat mixed (AFAIK)
16:30:26 <API> done
16:30:36 <clown> "wip"?
16:30:42 <API> work in progress
16:30:47 <clown> thanks.
16:30:50 <API> sorry I shouldn't have use that
16:30:55 <API> so any other update?
16:32:08 <mgorse> #info AT-SPI has a few minor build fixes, along with a fix to a crash in a C function that probably wasn't being used by anyone
16:32:59 <API> mgorse, so if  it wasn't used by anyone, how the crash was detected
16:33:01 <API> ?
16:33:25 <mgorse> API: It gave a compiler warning. I was passing parameters in the wrong order.
16:33:33 <API> ah, ok
16:34:56 <API> any other update?
16:36:04 <API> ok, so lets move then
16:36:17 <API> #topic W3C updates
16:36:19 <API> clown, ?
16:36:53 <clown> a couple of things...
16:37:23 <clown> #info the bugzilla for the ARIA User Agent Implementation Guide is now public.
16:37:45 <clown> #info the url for the bugzillas is: https://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/buglist.cgi?component=Platform%20APIs&list_id=2458&product=ARIA
16:38:15 <clown> #info the document associated with these bugs is: http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/aria-implementation/
16:38:55 <clown> #info with respect to the Independent User Interface work, there is a new event proposed.
16:39:26 <clown> #info there is a recognized need to allow users to quickly navigate to major sections of a GUI
16:39:45 <clown> #info an example is the toolbar in a rich text editor
16:40:08 <clown> #info proposed event name is focusRequest
16:40:45 <clown> #info stil speculative, but the thought is to include menu bar, toolbar, window, and palettes as the targets of the kind of focus move.
16:41:04 <API> so a kind of meta-focus?
16:41:23 <API> well a similar functionality is there at gnome-shell
16:41:30 <API> I mean the ctrl+alt+switch
16:41:31 <clown> #info on keyboard systems (laptop, desktop), authors would define keystrokes that would invoke this event
16:41:36 * API holding
16:42:12 <clown> #info the web app would handle the event by moving (keyboard) focus to the major gui object (e.g, the toolbar).
16:42:46 <clown> #info but the event is meant to also work in with devices that don't have a keyboard.  a touch screen, or through voice command.
16:42:55 <clown> done — questions?
16:43:17 <API> hmm, so in that way
16:43:24 <clown> API, yes, this function is sometime there in the desktop.
16:43:37 <API> a kind of "main gui objects" are being defined
16:43:39 <clown> but not typically in web apps.
16:43:54 <API> I mean that the proposal is something like focusRequest (gui-element-1)
16:44:03 <API> but who define those gui-elements?
16:44:31 <clown> that is the next step.  The group realizes this is a good idea, but now the details need to be worked out.
16:44:39 <API> ah ok
16:44:41 <API> thanks
16:44:51 <API> so, more questions to clown in this topic?
16:44:57 <clown> so, the working group will take a stab at it, and at some point solicit comments from the public at large.
16:46:09 <API> well, as nobody else seems to be asking
16:46:15 <API> I will move to next point
16:46:24 <API> btw, clown thanks for the update
16:46:27 <API> #topic Marketing
16:46:29 <API> jjmarin, ?
16:46:43 <clown> wlcm
16:47:58 <jjmarin> I'm afraid there no update this week.
16:48:45 <API> no? I saw a lot of activity on marketing list
16:48:58 <API> although I didn't have time to see what they are talking about
16:49:10 <jjmarin> well, yes but is not related to a11y
16:49:32 <jjmarin> possibly a Webkit related FoG
16:50:03 <jjmarin> about security and privacy
16:50:34 <API> ok, so as you didn't have anything to add
16:50:43 <API> and as jhernandez finally joined us
16:50:50 <API> lets go back and recover ...
16:50:57 <API> #topic Python 3
16:51:18 <API> jhernandez, we talked about that before
16:51:23 <jhernandez> yup
16:51:24 <API> and I added this action
16:51:25 <API> <API> #action joanie or API, will ping jhernandez, as he was not at the meeting
16:51:30 <API> so as you are here now ;)
16:51:39 <jhernandez> it's ok
16:51:46 <API> we were saying that it would be good to have accerciser moved to python3 for the next release
16:51:57 <API> <API> #info 3.7.3, needed before December 12th at 23:59 UTC
16:52:03 <API> jhernandez, how do you see it?
16:52:12 <clown> no pressure, jhernandez.  ;-)
16:52:15 <jhernandez> I'm ok with it
16:52:53 <jhernandez> I talked to joanie before and I said that this is on top my accerciser's TODO list
16:53:14 <jhernandez> but the last two weeks have been crazy for me
16:53:24 <API> well, thats the reason I ask
16:53:32 <API> as previous two weeks were crazy ...
16:53:37 <jhernandez> yup
16:53:43 <API> how feasible do you see the deadline I mentioned before?
16:53:49 <API> do you need help? anything else?
16:53:54 <jhernandez> I do feasible
16:54:24 <API> jhernandez, so, some pretty #info please?
16:54:28 <jhernandez> and Joanie offered herself to support me on to get this task done
16:55:43 <jhernandez> #info Hopefully, Accerciser 3.7.3 will be python3 based. Joanie offered herself to support me on this task.
16:55:52 <jhernandez> are u ok?
16:55:54 <jhernandez> :]
16:56:16 <API> ok, thanks
16:56:26 <API> so as just 5 minutes till the end
16:56:29 <jhernandez> the main problem is that I'm very busy with Cloud4All stuff
16:56:34 <jhernandez> :/
16:56:49 <API> as I said, thats the reason I was asking
16:56:52 <jhernandez> ok ok
16:56:55 <API> #topic miscellaneous time
16:57:17 <API> everybody has 5 minutes to add something, forgotten on previous topics or about a new topic
16:57:32 * jhernandez raises his hand
16:57:59 <jhernandez> it's cloud4all related
16:58:35 <jhernandez> the implementers has just started their activities
16:59:21 <jhernandez> and well, as some of you already know, I'm involved in the Linux/GNOME implementation
16:59:36 <API> jhernandez, what do you mean for "activities"?
16:59:41 <API> activities like ....
16:59:47 <API> show people a new webpage?
16:59:50 <jhernandez> activities = real implementations
16:59:57 <API> ah ok
17:00:05 <API> how many implementations will be?
17:00:12 <jhernandez> of the cloud4all architecture into the different devices/applications/scenarios
17:00:13 <API> you are at the linux/GNOME implementation
17:00:15 <API> what others?
17:00:42 <jhernandez> API: http://wiki.gpii.net/index.php/Implementations
17:00:47 <clown> I expect windows and mac os x
17:00:51 * clown looks.
17:01:52 <jhernandez> API: and yes, I'm the Linux/GNOME, but I'm involved in Smartphones and Simplephones
17:01:55 <jhernandez> too
17:02:04 <jhernandez> and
17:02:08 <API> simplephones
17:02:16 <API> I thought that they were just called phones
17:02:27 <API> simplephones sounds like dumbphones
17:02:29 * jhernandez thoughts the same
17:02:32 <jhernandez> xD
17:02:36 <API> probably it is just a false friend :P
17:02:44 <jhernandez> xD
17:03:27 <jhernandez> the point is that I did a draft for the Linux/GNOME implementation
17:03:36 <clown> they call them "feature phones" here.
17:04:06 <API> jhernandez, here: http://wiki.gpii.net/index.php/Implementations
17:04:09 <jhernandez> and I'd like to align my work on Cloud4All with the GNOME community
17:04:11 <API> what means "partial orca"?
17:05:25 <jhernandez> API: since I did not work on this wiki page, I really don't know who wrote this and what does he/she wanted to say with 'partial orca'
17:05:49 <API> jhernandez, ok
17:05:51 <clown> it might have something to do with gsettings
17:05:52 <API> lets try this
17:06:04 <clown> orca doesn't use gsettings except for turning on/off.
17:06:06 <jhernandez> since aleiva quited from Emergya, I'm starting to drive this
17:06:13 <clown> but that's just a wild guess.
17:06:13 <API> what is the difference between linux/GNOME and Linux/GNOME AT?
17:06:24 <jhernandez> and the 'real' work has just started
17:07:31 <jhernandez> API: sorry if I can't answer this, but I think this was extracted from a document I don't know about
17:07:34 <jhernandez> :/
17:08:15 <jhernandez> anyway, I did a Linux/GNOME first draft
17:08:25 * joanie waves
17:08:31 <jhernandez> http://wiki.gpii.net/index.php/GNU/Linux
17:08:36 <clown> you can see all the authors here: http://wiki.gpii.net/index.php?title=Implementations&action=history
17:08:46 <clown> looks like Gregg Vanderheiden started it.
17:09:27 <API> jhernandez, ok, anyway
17:09:31 <API> and in relation with
17:09:35 * clown hi joanie
17:09:45 <API> <jhernandez> and I'd like to align my work on Cloud4All with the GNOME community
17:09:49 <API> as we are already over time
17:09:53 * joanie apologizes for the schedule conflict
17:09:59 <API> probably it would be good if you send a mail to the mailing list
17:10:21 <API> explaining the purpose of the project, and how do you want to align to the GNOME Community
17:10:35 <jhernandez> API: sure!
17:10:45 <API> not sure if at this moment, without most of the background,
17:10:51 <API> the meeting is the proper place
17:11:36 <jhernandez> my intention was only to inform the GNOME a11y team that my 'real' work here was just started
17:11:57 <API> jhernandez, ah ok
17:12:14 <API> as you mentioned "align with GNOME" I thought that you wanted feedback or something
17:12:26 <jhernandez> API: yes, feedback, ideas, etc ...
17:14:04 <API> ok, in that case "mail with background and stuff" still applies
17:14:13 <API> and, as we are already 15 minutes over time ...
17:14:16 <API> anything else for misc time
17:14:37 <jhernandez> not from my side
17:15:31 <clown> not me
17:15:39 <jjmarin> me neither
17:16:46 <API> ok, closing the meeting then
17:16:49 <API> thanks everybody
17:16:52 <API> #endmeeting